還需要圓桶嗎? - 魚
By Skylar Davis
at 2010-09-07T22:38
at 2010-09-07T22:38
Table of Contents
: → NorthernStar:bonjour版友真勤勞認真,不過那個用掛號文看會有系統 09/05 11:29
: → NorthernStar:性偏誤的問題。因為外掛是很多新手一開始的設備,然 09/05 11:30
: → NorthernStar:後新手比較容易出問題...老手則是出了問題也不掛號 09/05 11:31
: → NorthernStar:掛了號也沒救 XD 外掛雖然效率的確不高,但是還是有 09/05 11:34
: → NorthernStar:不少用外掛養得不錯的。圓桶則有清理的問題 09/05 11:34
: → NorthernStar:而且若是在溶氧不足的請況下,用圓桶反而會有問題 09/05 11:39
: → NorthernStar:上部的確是便宜、增加溶氧、且提供大量濾材空間。 09/05 11:40
: → NorthernStar:小小辦公一尺缸+正常飼養,外掛是撐得起啦。底缸當 09/05 12:07
: → NorthernStar:然強大,不過價位、挖洞或溢流等成本都不低。bonjour 09/05 12:08
: → NorthernStar:版友現在都向高成本、大缸子看齊,好羨慕Q____Q 09/05 12:09
回來看到回文這麼多,還真嚇了一跳。
的確是從我開始說溶氧那邊就把文章導偏了,
圓桶跟氧這個部分我會在後面解釋。
至於外掛是不是就養不好?我還是持否定的態度。
對於新手而言,是不是用圓桶比用外掛好? 的確是如此,功力不足靠器材補足。
當然,條件也要是新手願意花重本。不然談一個可行性低的方案也沒什麼意義。
但是,圓桶對於新手而言是「最好」的過濾方式?
我想並非如此,就各類過濾效率與價錢影響可行性觀之。
且圓桶並不是在各方面都是最優秀的,
所以,推薦的過濾方式就要按個案不同而異。
今天一個新手要一尺裸缸養將魚,堆圓桶做什麼?
今天一個新手要大手筆搞個大型陽性草缸,推上部做什麼?
所以,我不大能認同「推廣新手用圓桶」這個觀念,還請見諒。
因為太過簡化,可行性上也有難度。
就跟要想要玩草缸的版友通通都去買一套鋼瓶組一樣不可能。
單單把結論丟出來,我想無論對新手或老手其實的價值都不會比
慢慢地從基本理論開始講起來得重要。
當基本理論有了,是要推廣哪種形式的過濾,也就不重要了。
-----
在溶氧部分,
氧在圓桶內究竟少了多少?我不清楚。
有沒有出水時的氧濃度數據?我也沒有。
不過,otto的八道過濾就是建立在前面七道能夠建立一個厭氧環境上。
所以,圓桶內氧濃度會變低是可以理解的。
問題在於會低多少?
因為otto的流量僅240L/H,而且有七道過濾材能把好氧消耗到厭氧環境,
一個動輒1000L/H,且只有一道的圓桶內養濃度究竟會減低多少?
先插開舉一個eheim2227呼吸式的例子,
這個是連eheim本身都說是為了解決舊式圓桶的問題而設計的圓桶,
eheim(的代理商)還強調這不適合使用在草缸。
http://www.discoveraquatics.co.uk/filtration/2227.htm
第二張圖就是透過呼吸設備增加圓桶內的氧,從而增加硝化菌的「生存量」以及「效率」
所以,增加圓桶內氧濃度的確可以提高硝化系統功能,
而降低養濃度相對硝化系統功能就降低。
接下來回到「一道」究竟會降低多少?
我沒有數據,
不過按照otto七道,每一道的遞減應該不是等差遞減,
而是等比遞減。
也就是說第一道應該減少氧濃度最多。
邏輯的推衍是:
「經過第一道,減低A濃度的氧,剩下的氧濃度為N-A,
第二道只獲得N-A的氧,由於氧濃度較低,引述eheim2227,所以硝化菌作用效率降低
經過第二道再減低B濃度,而A>B(硝化菌作用率、生存量低,消耗的氧當然就變少),
以此類推經過第三道降低C濃度氧,A>B>C....
到第七道成為厭氧環境。」
所以,這個遞減應該會是等比遞減,
也就是第一道減低的氧濃度會最多。
酷蝦網甚至有篇被列為精華的文章,內文是透過2215動力捅再串兩個2215前置,
然後就可以培養厭氧菌的說法。
若此為真,那第一道消耗的溶氧說不一定會在一半以上。
這就是為什麼我說在非草缸的圓桶,其工作效率會降低的原因。
這是源自於圓桶獨一無二的封閉性。
-----
以上是針對「圓桶內溶氧低,造成硝化菌效率降低」做解釋,
當然,誠如XXPLUS版友說的,這是可以透過某些方式來解決,
我主要只是說明圓桶與溶氧的關係在邏輯上應該是沒有問題。
至於談到解決的方式,那各種過濾方式也都有針對其缺點加以解決的方法,
所以就不在這邊多提了。
--
: → NorthernStar:性偏誤的問題。因為外掛是很多新手一開始的設備,然 09/05 11:30
: → NorthernStar:後新手比較容易出問題...老手則是出了問題也不掛號 09/05 11:31
: → NorthernStar:掛了號也沒救 XD 外掛雖然效率的確不高,但是還是有 09/05 11:34
: → NorthernStar:不少用外掛養得不錯的。圓桶則有清理的問題 09/05 11:34
: → NorthernStar:而且若是在溶氧不足的請況下,用圓桶反而會有問題 09/05 11:39
: → NorthernStar:上部的確是便宜、增加溶氧、且提供大量濾材空間。 09/05 11:40
: → NorthernStar:小小辦公一尺缸+正常飼養,外掛是撐得起啦。底缸當 09/05 12:07
: → NorthernStar:然強大,不過價位、挖洞或溢流等成本都不低。bonjour 09/05 12:08
: → NorthernStar:版友現在都向高成本、大缸子看齊,好羨慕Q____Q 09/05 12:09
回來看到回文這麼多,還真嚇了一跳。
的確是從我開始說溶氧那邊就把文章導偏了,
圓桶跟氧這個部分我會在後面解釋。
至於外掛是不是就養不好?我還是持否定的態度。
對於新手而言,是不是用圓桶比用外掛好? 的確是如此,功力不足靠器材補足。
當然,條件也要是新手願意花重本。不然談一個可行性低的方案也沒什麼意義。
但是,圓桶對於新手而言是「最好」的過濾方式?
我想並非如此,就各類過濾效率與價錢影響可行性觀之。
且圓桶並不是在各方面都是最優秀的,
所以,推薦的過濾方式就要按個案不同而異。
今天一個新手要一尺裸缸養將魚,堆圓桶做什麼?
今天一個新手要大手筆搞個大型陽性草缸,推上部做什麼?
所以,我不大能認同「推廣新手用圓桶」這個觀念,還請見諒。
因為太過簡化,可行性上也有難度。
就跟要想要玩草缸的版友通通都去買一套鋼瓶組一樣不可能。
單單把結論丟出來,我想無論對新手或老手其實的價值都不會比
慢慢地從基本理論開始講起來得重要。
當基本理論有了,是要推廣哪種形式的過濾,也就不重要了。
-----
在溶氧部分,
氧在圓桶內究竟少了多少?我不清楚。
有沒有出水時的氧濃度數據?我也沒有。
不過,otto的八道過濾就是建立在前面七道能夠建立一個厭氧環境上。
所以,圓桶內氧濃度會變低是可以理解的。
問題在於會低多少?
因為otto的流量僅240L/H,而且有七道過濾材能把好氧消耗到厭氧環境,
一個動輒1000L/H,且只有一道的圓桶內養濃度究竟會減低多少?
先插開舉一個eheim2227呼吸式的例子,
這個是連eheim本身都說是為了解決舊式圓桶的問題而設計的圓桶,
eheim(的代理商)還強調這不適合使用在草缸。
http://www.discoveraquatics.co.uk/filtration/2227.htm
第二張圖就是透過呼吸設備增加圓桶內的氧,從而增加硝化菌的「生存量」以及「效率」
所以,增加圓桶內氧濃度的確可以提高硝化系統功能,
而降低養濃度相對硝化系統功能就降低。
接下來回到「一道」究竟會降低多少?
我沒有數據,
不過按照otto七道,每一道的遞減應該不是等差遞減,
而是等比遞減。
也就是說第一道應該減少氧濃度最多。
邏輯的推衍是:
「經過第一道,減低A濃度的氧,剩下的氧濃度為N-A,
第二道只獲得N-A的氧,由於氧濃度較低,引述eheim2227,所以硝化菌作用效率降低
經過第二道再減低B濃度,而A>B(硝化菌作用率、生存量低,消耗的氧當然就變少),
以此類推經過第三道降低C濃度氧,A>B>C....
到第七道成為厭氧環境。」
所以,這個遞減應該會是等比遞減,
也就是第一道減低的氧濃度會最多。
酷蝦網甚至有篇被列為精華的文章,內文是透過2215動力捅再串兩個2215前置,
然後就可以培養厭氧菌的說法。
若此為真,那第一道消耗的溶氧說不一定會在一半以上。
這就是為什麼我說在非草缸的圓桶,其工作效率會降低的原因。
這是源自於圓桶獨一無二的封閉性。
-----
以上是針對「圓桶內溶氧低,造成硝化菌效率降低」做解釋,
當然,誠如XXPLUS版友說的,這是可以透過某些方式來解決,
我主要只是說明圓桶與溶氧的關係在邏輯上應該是沒有問題。
至於談到解決的方式,那各種過濾方式也都有針對其缺點加以解決的方法,
所以就不在這邊多提了。
--
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